International Men's Day: An interview with Andrew Watkinson, Managing Director of CPiO

It’s International Men's Day on the 19th November 2024 and as the male figurehead here at CPiO, we wanted to hear and share Andrew’s thoughts on some of the challenges facing men and boys today, and learn of his own experiences. 

You’ve been in the IT industry for a long time. How has the industry changed since you first started?  

I'm not sure we have long enough to answer the question because there are so many changes it’s untrue. But for me, the most significant one is the Internet. 

When I started out in business, technology had a totally different pace. If you were using Excel for example, you would press a button and count to three before it did something. Now if we don't get an immediate response within an application, we think something is wrong and wonder why it’s so slow. 

There’s just far more tech in business today. But there’s more tech in our everyday lives.  The problem with that is everyone’s an expert. Where a technology provider used to be called upon for advice, people now feel like they have a better understanding of software and technical services and want to be more involved. So, when things get more complex, it can be difficult at times to ask people to leave it to us as the experts.  

With the Internet came the cloud. We all use the cloud in our daily lives, sometimes without realising. WhatsApp, iCloud, Netflix, these are all cloud services we use in our personal lives. Parallel to this, the finance software industry is taking a cloud first approach, with more and more applications now being cloud-based and sold via a subscription service. The way we consume technology has changed significantly. 

Come back and ask me in a few years and we’ll be talking about how AI has taken over – that’s the next major change to come in business.  

What trends or innovations have had the biggest impact on the business?  

Over the past 2-3 decades, the innovation that has had the biggest impact is mobile phones. 

When I first started there were no mobile phones – yes, I’m that old! 

Then we got mobiles, which we all remember were like bricks. They simply made calls, but that gave us the ability to contact one another when we were away from the office. Then came text messages and the ability to get emails on your phone. The Blackberry was groundbreaking at the time. Business no longer stayed within the business. Mobile phones were the beginning of working from anywhere. 

Now mobile phones can hold so many applications – our lives are stored on a small device in the palm of our hands. The downside of this in business is the speed we have become accustomed to. If you download an application, it takes minutes and it works right away.  

For our business, installing large solutions is a project. Sometimes people can't understand why something takes days to install. They think it should be immediate because they've got an app on their phone that was downloaded and ready to use within minutes. There’s a growing expectation that technology is all immediate.  

It becomes difficult to differentiate between a phone application that's doing what seems to be very clever things, and an application that's running a business because, on the face of it, it's all technology. 

Then, in more recent years we have the Covid effect. As a cloud provider, CPiO had been facilitating remote working since the launch of CPiO Cloud in 2009. But Covid expedited the remote working culture for many businesses that hadn’t previously considered it.  

Today, Teams or Zoom meetings are the norm and for me, it’s a blessing and a curse. We can get more work done and the work life balance is easier with people not travelling as much. Software can even be installed remotely and training delivered over Teams. But there's also the negative side. We haven't got that personable contact with people. It's not quite the same as being in the same room as one another and I do feel a sense of relief when I'm actually in a meeting with real people.

Can you share a memorable project or client experience from your career?  

There lies a very difficult question, because there's so many. 

The best projects for me are where somebody started out as just seeing us as a supplier - we're just putting something in. Then, after a while they turn to us and ask if we can help with other things, because the project's gone well. That started for me well before I was at CPiO with a customer who came with me to CPiO – The Saville Group. We grew from a supplier to a trusted advisor. 

Then we have charitable organisations as customers, such as the RSPCA. Being able to help and support them is very rewarding. We recognise their need for finance software, but also their priority – in this case, the animals they care for.  Therefore, it’s vital to put a solution together that is as cost effective as possible. That’s something I’m passionate about for non-profits and believe we do well. 

 
How have customer expectations changed, and how have you adapted to meet them?  

As we touched on earlier, the pace of technology has changed people’s expectations. We’re all guilty of it. We want everything now and expect it to work first time. 

For customers, when they've got something that's extremely complicated, such as a Sage X3 implementation, we have to set the expectation. We explain that complex ERP software isn’t a plug and play application. You've got to try it. You've got to test it. 

When we scope a project, we discuss objectives with the customer and set priorities. Project managers work with the customer’s internal project team to keep things on track. We can’t deliver immediately – show me a partner who can. But we have a proven record of meeting business objectives and delivering projects on time. 

 
What’s the most rewarding part of your job? 

I think it's when a customer moves from only seeing the software as their need, to coming out the other side and seeing us as the trusted advisor. 

When we've done a good job with a customer and they think ‘we trust those people, they've done what they've said’. That’s the foundation of a good relationship and it’s rewarding to foster those client relationships. 

And it’s the same with the staff. The accolades we get. We have staff who stay with the business for years. Many for 20 years plus. It’s rewarding for me and the Board to think we’re doing something right and keeping customers and staff. 

 
Who have been the positive role models in your life and why? 

I suppose role models start with our parents. In my case my father, but also my grandfather. I didn't meet my grandfather, but he was a businessman. I can recall getting told the stories of what he did and how he looked after his employees and that’s how I was brought up to believe businesses were run. 

Today I look at people specifically in our industry who have been successful. Graham Wiley, the co-founder of Sage, progressed from a programmer who wrote the original Sage accounts package, to being a very successful businessman. In the early 80’s, together with David Goldman, he persuaded Lord Alan Sugar to put a free copy of Sage on every Amstrad PC that he sold. The software was free but if you wanted to continue using it, you had to pay a support fee. And that was the foundation of Sage. That kind of business acumen is admirable. 

 
How do you maintain a healthy work-life balance?  

We've got an adage which we try to instill in the staff, which is ‘we work to live, we don't live to work’. 

You've got to put family first and you've got to put your life balance in the right area. Everyone should put their all into work, but that's only when they're working. You shouldn't be working every hour God sends. We all need something to take our minds away from work. 

For me, we have dogs. So, we have to spend time with the dogs. You can't avoid it - they have to be looked after and be walked. So that gets me out of the house daily, even in the bad weather. And then, certainly during the summertime, there's golf. When you go off to golf you meet a circle of friends who play golf… and we talk about golf. We don't talk about work. 

The work-life balance is finding a hobby, or something that takes you away from work. Everyone needs a life outside of work. 

 
Poor mental health in men and boys is rapidly increasing in the UK, what do you think some of the factors are that are contributing to this rapid rise? 

I think a lot of mental health issues stem from the readily available information on the Internet, social media and TV. Now, instead of fantasy we have reality shows and YouTube ‘stars’ and they've got big cars and houses, lots of money, they've got fashion, jewellery, etc. People, especially young men and boys, can feel inadequate because they haven't got that lifestyle. 

Before you would come across these people once in a blue moon or they would be true celebrities – pop stars and film stars or business tycoons. Now normal people seemingly become rich overnight. Men can feel inferior because we're nowhere near as successful and the benchmark of what society sees as successful has got a lot higher. 

On top of that, there is the demand on our time. Going back to the pace of life, everything is immediate, and people expect an immediate response. Technology keeps us connected and during Covid for example, it was a lifeline for many as the only way to stay in touch with friends and family. However, we can never truly switch off – texts, WhatsApp messages, emails, Instagram, TikTok, LinkedIn, the list goes on and there’s always a connection to the outside world – and that outside world is always able to get in. We no longer close the door and shut the world out. 

What support or advice can you offer to the male employees at CPiO if they are struggling? 

The difference between men and women, is men don't share. Men don't share with anybody, so they won't share with their partner, they won't share with their siblings, they won't share with their mates, they just bottle it all inside and then it builds up and it gets worse.  

So, the biggest advice I could give to anybody is to talk. Be open about problems, whether that’s work, money, health, relationships. Just sharing a problem can be a weight off your shoulders – as the saying goes ‘a problem shared is a problem halved’. 

And if you don't feel comfortable opening up to colleagues, friends or family, then talk to a professional. Mental health issues are rising and there are many organisations that offer help and support. We all need to understand there is no shame in admitting to struggling. It actually takes strength to open up. 

My door is always open. I would hate the idea of any CPiO employee struggling in silence. If one of the men - or ladies - in the business reached out for support, I would always make time for them. 

What advice would you give your 20-year-old self?  

Enjoy the journey that you're on! 

Don’t go hell for leather trying to make as much money as possible, looking to retirement. It's what you're doing today, and how you do it that counts. Take a step back and think, ‘OK, what am I doing today?’ and at the end of the day ask the question ‘What have I done today that would make my family feel proud?’  

When starting out in business, a lot of people believe the end justifies the means, but we soon learn it doesn't. Take pride in the journey, don’t be afraid to question yourself and others and just enjoy the journey - you never know when it’s going to end.  

If you or a male you know needs help, advice or support, visit the IMD website where you can find contact information for a number of charities and organisations specifically supporting men and boys.